Fair Criticism or Bigotry?It is very common to hear foreigners sitting around complaining about problems in China. Normally there is validity to at least some of the complaints, although often the way things are presented makes the comments come off badly. The line between legitimate criticism and excessive whining—or even bigotry—can blur pretty quickly. These thoughts have always lingered, but recently a thread in our forums focused on this theme, and a recent post by The Humanaught’s Ryan wondering whether he is a racist crystallized them for me. I am not going to go into the specifics of those now. Instead I will lay out a more general argument. I will begin with a premise that is, well, painfully obvious: China is really different than a lot of other places. When foreigners arrive the country can feel overwhelming: the language is completely distinct from anything in Europe, manners are different, and, possibly most importantly to those dubbed “China-bashers,” hygiene is quite different. In one sense the language is a minor point, but the feeling of helplessness it can induce sometimes leads to a sense of insecurity. On the other hand, manners are a different and more fundamental point. It can be very difficult to distinguish between cultural differences and simple rudeness. For example, much has been made about Chinese people’s aversion to queuing in an orderly way. However, believing that cutting in line is acceptable here is a complete misnomer. Chinese people know that they are not supposed to cut, but some do it anyway, and the mob mentality reinforces that there is nothing wrong with it. Yet if you ever confront someone about cutting, you will notice that they will rarely argue. Often they will turn around and look at the line as if completely astounded that 200 people are standing there for the same purpose. (My absolute favorite is when someone apologizes, lets you in front, and then cuts the person directly behind. Classic!) Anyway, there are two points here: it is difficult to know when people are being genuinely rude and are not just used to different customs, and second, this type of rudeness rarely occurs with large groups of educated Chinese (throwing one professor in with the masses is a different story). There are many poor, minimally educated people from the countryside, and they often have a different sense of appropriateness. This is not, however, the same thing as saying that Chinese culture is backwards. Finally, the issue of hygiene is absolutely a fair criticism from my perspective. Performing various bodily functions in the street is socially unacceptable in most countries because it is an issue of public safety. People can get sick from it and there should be serious campaigns to stamp out such activities. Foreigners, or anyone else, should definitely feel free to express their objections to this type of activity. The problem arises when people make attacks about legitimate issues personal attacks on individuals, or the entire society. It is unfair to hurl ugly labels at an entire people or culture based on the actions of some, even if those acting a given way represent a wide swath of the country. That does not mean that criticism should not be leveled, but it should be done in a way that reflects an understanding that, for example, most Shanghainese businessmen have no great love of a child defecating in the streets. To be sure, it is not a uniquely foreign idea that, to be quite blunt, shit does not belong on the sidewalk. When people make the argument that it is unhygienic, and not that “Chinese people are dirty,” they may find a more welcoming audience. Immigrants who come to western countries and complain endlessly are not typically embraced with welcoming arms. On the contrary, they are usually shunned and have name thrown at them. However, those who become part of the fabric of their adopted country, and then offer their opinions about policies in a constructive manner tend to be received better. This seems like a reasonable thought to keep in mind when making a legitimate criticisms in China. Post a comment to voice your opinion
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Comments
developing country
The simple fact is that China is a developing country, whereas US, UK, France, Japan, Australia etc. are developed country. That means in many aspects of society, we lag behind. I think you are being polite when you say "China" is different. In some areas, we simply have lots catch up to do. In other areas, we do have differences, but I know many foreigners will just regard them as backwardnesses.
The key issue is not complaining, it is only natural for people from developed & democratic countries to complain in China. The issue is keeping complaining again and again and again without saying much further than mere complaints. What is the point of doing this, like Chinese do not know these things? It feels very much like those "gothcia" or "we are better than you" messages. It can get very quickly from Chinese are this and that to these people are this and that BECAUSE they are Chinese. It is very condescending.
Frankly, I do not think this will change unless China becomes more "developed". So Chinese should really focus on concerns from other disadvantaged Chinese. Our mistake is that we simply treasure foreign opinions way too much for nothing. We need to care about the welfare of our own people more.
"The simple fact is that
"The simple fact is that China is a developing country"
ZZZZZZZZ...ZZZZZZZZ...ZZZZZZZZZ
Ummm...have we heard this before?
BTW, Josh...can you please fix the web site so that we don't have to go around being "Anonymous" all the time and then be accused of having no balls to post under a user name? Thanks!
Anonymous
If you do not want to post anonymously you can register here:
http://www.chinaexpat.com/user/register
We include the anonymous option so that people can post more easily, but if you want to have an online identity it is quite easy.
Thanks.
Okay, I got a
Okay, I got an account.
"Ummm...have we heard this before?" So what,
that automatically makes my arguments invalid?
I also said this underdevelopment is not limited
to economics. And the complaints from lots of
foreigners are "natural", or in other words,
understandable. what are your opinions besides
this one liner?
I just can't agree any more
I used to agree with this opinion, but after living in the mainland for two years now, I just can't agree any more. As a foreigner, I came here accepting the "developing country" argument. But frankly, it is bullshit. I never wanted to say this, but most of the stereotypes are true. I am engaged to a Chinese (actually Hongkongese), so don't think I say this easily. In fact, it has been even harder for her to live in the mainland and experience the reality of her own culture. They really are dirty, rude, selfish, lack integrity, etc etc. I believe this was not true in historical times, but since the PPC toppled the classes and eradicated any "real history", I believe the culture really is as bad as everyone thinks, and it is going to take a very long time for it to recover, if it ever does.
WOW
"most of the stereotypes are true", "They really are dirty, rude, selfish, lack integrity, etc etc". I have to give you that it takes some guts/frustrations to say these.
I agree with you China is a pretty shallow place in some sense and mutual trust is at all time low. You hear "developing country" arguments a lot as excuses , so it is BS to you now. Hehe, I am not using them as excuses. Bad things are bad things. That is why we should do more to get better lives.
What I was saying is: guess what actually lots of Chinese know about these things too, although they might not like to hear it from a foreigner.
Second, for whatever reason, we indeed value foreigner's opinions a lot, we should do concrete things to improve instead of worrying about "image".
Finally, do not let you disdain stops you. Try to get to know local people in a deeper level, scratch the surface a little bit, at least ask why "They really are dirty, rude, selfish, lack integrity, etc etc"。
there is a great related post from China Law Blog
http://www.chinalawblog.com/2007/08/china_bloggers_getting_deep.html#com...
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